[ mona / prog / sol ]

sol


The Trans/TERF Debates

1 2020-10-14 18:02

Any hot takes on the issue?

2 2020-10-14 18:24

>>1
First are victims of xenoestrogens and greedy industry that implements surgical correction for psychological disorders.
Second are ideological gender supremacists that are now forced to compete for victim class status with the first, who easily generate oppression points due being much smaller and artificial minority.

3 2020-10-14 20:45 *

I am the second poster in this thread.

4 2020-10-14 22:22

>>2

ideological gender supremacists

Can you elaborate on this?

5 2020-10-15 02:13

>>1
>>2

Ok, I'll bite, but only because I think you're wrong. Traditional feminists are a kind of liberal, and like liberals everywhere, they try to justify their views with rational argument. It may be wrong, but it's an argument. J.K. Rowling wrote a long, reasoned essay about why she didn't accept the basic principles of trans activism.

Trans activists, conversely, follow the social justice belief system, which isn't at all liberal. For them, it's about sin. Rowling's long essay was an attempt to justify the sin, so they didn't engage with it. They just kept pointing to the sin. And it worked, for some reason.

Social justice is grinding up old school liberal leftists all over the place. TERFS are just one front.

6 2020-10-15 04:10

Traditional feminists are a kind of liberal

Traditional feminists were left-wing progressives.
Look up suffragettes and the first-wave feminism.

7 2020-10-15 04:12

Traditional feminists are a kind of liberal

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s_Social_and_Political_Union
The Women's Social and Political Union (WSPU) was a women-only political movement and leading militant organisation campaigning for women's suffrage in the United Kingdom from 1903 to 1918.[1] Known from 1906 as the suffragettes, its membership and policies were tightly controlled by Emmeline Pankhurst and her daughters Christabel and Sylvia (although Sylvia was eventually expelled).

The WSPU membership became known for civil disobedience and direct action. It heckled politicians, held demonstrations and marches, broke the law to force arrests, broke windows in prominent buildings, set fire to post boxes, committed night-time arson of unoccupied houses and churches, and—when imprisoned—went on hunger strike and endured force-feeding.

8 2020-10-15 05:38

Its time to Repeal 19th.
Feminism hasn't resulted in anything good for society.

9 2020-10-15 06:26 *

I am still the second poster in this thread.

10 2020-10-15 06:33 *

>>5
TERFs are not liberals, they are reactionaries who believe in gender essentialism bullshit. "Trans activists" are liberal, who believe in a gender pluralism. But all the cool kids these days are gender nihilists.

11 2020-10-15 07:43

>>9
That's a very elaborate way to say 'samefag'.

12 2020-10-15 10:57

I'll go against the consensus here and say that so-called "TERF"s, or radical feminists, are right. I've been reading their blogs and forums, and for the most part their analysis is solid (I'm of course going to disagree that men are inherently evil, but I understand that for some, their experiences lead them to that conclusion; The accusations that all mean do X is mistakenly used instead of most people who do X are men, etc.).
>>2

Second are ideological gender supremacists that are now forced to compete for victim class status

Radical feminists are usually opposed to "gender" as a concept. They argue sex, as biological category, is more essential to their struggle. And I do think that this is an honest struggle, and as such isn't focused on "victim class status".
It's often misconceived, that Feminism is just about equality. It's part of it, for sure, as part of a wider humanist project. But Feminism is also critically concerned with what separates women: Nobody is advocating for equal abortion rights for men and woman. Breast cancer disproportionately affects women. Domestic violence hits women harder then men. etc.
>>10

TERFs are not liberals, they are reactionaries who believe in gender essentialism bullshit.

They are sex existentialists, as there is a real difference between man and woman, that should be acknowledged. They are probably closed to what you call "gender nihilism", as they agree that gender non-conformity/LGB is totally fine.

13 2020-10-20 03:10 *

There's a radfem imageboard.

14 2020-10-22 22:31 *

>>2

xenoestrogens

Only takes one word to out yourself as a retard.

15


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